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	<title>Comments on: The problem of genre: &#8220;Grit Romance&#8221;?</title>
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		<title>By: Michelle Buckman</title>
		<link>http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/the-problem-of-genre-grit-romance/comment-page-1#comment-20976</link>
		<dc:creator>Michelle Buckman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Aug 2010 09:46:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/?p=975#comment-20976</guid>
		<description>Moriah,
I came across this thread quite by accident in a google search, and saw my name mentioned. &quot;Grit Lit&quot; is definitely going strong. In most cases, the story needs a happy ending to counter the darkness that the character and reader have traveled throughout the story. My newest book, RACHEL&#039;S CONTRITION, which releases in a few weeks is definitely Grit-Lit. Given the subject of a mother suffering from the death of her child, I wouldn&#039;t say it has a happy ending, but it does have an uplifting ending.

Michelle Buckman</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Moriah,<br />
I came across this thread quite by accident in a google search, and saw my name mentioned. &#8220;Grit Lit&#8221; is definitely going strong. In most cases, the story needs a happy ending to counter the darkness that the character and reader have traveled throughout the story. My newest book, RACHEL&#8217;S CONTRITION, which releases in a few weeks is definitely Grit-Lit. Given the subject of a mother suffering from the death of her child, I wouldn&#8217;t say it has a happy ending, but it does have an uplifting ending.</p>
<p>Michelle Buckman</p>
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		<title>By: MoJo</title>
		<link>http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/the-problem-of-genre-grit-romance/comment-page-1#comment-1793</link>
		<dc:creator>MoJo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Feb 2009 22:12:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/?p=975#comment-1793</guid>
		<description>@Ing
&lt;blockquote&gt;riveting drama and interesting characters might just appeal to parts of BOTH those audiences instead of neither?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Yeah, I&#039;m not sure how to get that across in a couple of sentences, though, which is my biggest problem.  &quot;Riff off Hamlet&quot; has become my go-to Q&amp;D answer.

&lt;blockquote&gt;This is why I think that authors should focus on creating a property (and some speculative fiction authors and I would guess romance authors are quite good at doing this)&lt;/blockquote&gt;

This is the conclusion I&#039;m slowly coming to, Wm.  Have you been following &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.theurbanelitist.com/are-authors-like-journals/1478/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;David Nygren&#039;s&lt;/a&gt; side of our conversation on monetizing fiction?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Ing</p>
<blockquote><p>riveting drama and interesting characters might just appeal to parts of BOTH those audiences instead of neither?</p></blockquote>
<p>Yeah, I&#8217;m not sure how to get that across in a couple of sentences, though, which is my biggest problem.  &#8220;Riff off Hamlet&#8221; has become my go-to Q&#038;D answer.</p>
<blockquote><p>This is why I think that authors should focus on creating a property (and some speculative fiction authors and I would guess romance authors are quite good at doing this)</p></blockquote>
<p>This is the conclusion I&#8217;m slowly coming to, Wm.  Have you been following <a href="http://www.theurbanelitist.com/are-authors-like-journals/1478/" rel="nofollow">David Nygren&#8217;s</a> side of our conversation on monetizing fiction?</p>
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		<title>By: Wm Morris</title>
		<link>http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/the-problem-of-genre-grit-romance/comment-page-1#comment-1792</link>
		<dc:creator>Wm Morris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Feb 2009 21:22:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/?p=975#comment-1792</guid>
		<description>I think that indie music has two major advantages over indie publishing:

1. The ability of its artists to make money via touring and merchandise.

2. The shortness of the dominant form (pop song vs. novel) and what that means for the social nature of the two art forms/industries. Music is much more easily shared, discussed, listed, reviewed, consumed, etc. Yes, there are book clubs and GoodReads and all that. But it&#039;s a lot easier to develop a lifestyle around a band than an author. Not that that doesn&#039;t happen (JK Rowling, Stephenie Meyer, Neil Gaiman, etc.). But much more difficult. 

Okay, I&#039;m going to cheat and add a three:

3. It&#039;s much easier (although not easy) to build and promote a scene with music. More opportunities for collaboration, cross-promotion, shared aesthetics, shared knowledge, shared touring, etc. And for all those to spill into ways for fans to benefit and participate.

This is why I think that authors should focus on creating a property (and some speculative fiction authors and I would guess romance authors are quite good at doing this) that can lead to more indie music-like activities (including fan fiction, products, conventions, collaborations, etc.). And the biggest barrier there, imo, is that the marketplace and culture is still so tied in to novels, which take a long time to write and read.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that indie music has two major advantages over indie publishing:</p>
<p>1. The ability of its artists to make money via touring and merchandise.</p>
<p>2. The shortness of the dominant form (pop song vs. novel) and what that means for the social nature of the two art forms/industries. Music is much more easily shared, discussed, listed, reviewed, consumed, etc. Yes, there are book clubs and GoodReads and all that. But it&#8217;s a lot easier to develop a lifestyle around a band than an author. Not that that doesn&#8217;t happen (JK Rowling, Stephenie Meyer, Neil Gaiman, etc.). But much more difficult. </p>
<p>Okay, I&#8217;m going to cheat and add a three:</p>
<p>3. It&#8217;s much easier (although not easy) to build and promote a scene with music. More opportunities for collaboration, cross-promotion, shared aesthetics, shared knowledge, shared touring, etc. And for all those to spill into ways for fans to benefit and participate.</p>
<p>This is why I think that authors should focus on creating a property (and some speculative fiction authors and I would guess romance authors are quite good at doing this) that can lead to more indie music-like activities (including fan fiction, products, conventions, collaborations, etc.). And the biggest barrier there, imo, is that the marketplace and culture is still so tied in to novels, which take a long time to write and read.</p>
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		<title>By: Ing</title>
		<link>http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/the-problem-of-genre-grit-romance/comment-page-1#comment-1791</link>
		<dc:creator>Ing</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Feb 2009 20:42:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/?p=975#comment-1791</guid>
		<description>The book publishing world has a HUGE label problem.  Music has a similar problem, except that there&#039;s a viable indie scene (actually, dozens of scenes).  I don&#039;t consider myself an indie music fan as it&#039;s normally conceived, but a good half the music I listen to is indie in every way that counts -- you generally won&#039;t see it shelved in chain stores or hear it on commercial radio, and some of it can&#039;t even be found on iTunes, either.  But there is a dedicated community of listeners who go out of their way to find it and buy it, and there are a few independent publishers who make it possible.  (And there are also a lot of bands doing what you all are doing with your books, too.)  I dunno what kind of living these musicians make, but they do get heard.

Seems to me that publishing has been handcuffed (or has handcuffed itself?) by its own perception of its audience.  I mean, do they ever think that a book that doesn&#039;t quite fit the erotic romance mold or the inspirational romance mold, but has riveting drama and interesting characters might just appeal to parts of BOTH those audiences instead of neither?

This looks to me like an industry that&#039;s too frightened of dying to survive.

I dunno, though; maybe I&#039;m overestimating the independent part of the music biz and underestimating the indie part of book publishing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The book publishing world has a HUGE label problem.  Music has a similar problem, except that there&#8217;s a viable indie scene (actually, dozens of scenes).  I don&#8217;t consider myself an indie music fan as it&#8217;s normally conceived, but a good half the music I listen to is indie in every way that counts &#8212; you generally won&#8217;t see it shelved in chain stores or hear it on commercial radio, and some of it can&#8217;t even be found on iTunes, either.  But there is a dedicated community of listeners who go out of their way to find it and buy it, and there are a few independent publishers who make it possible.  (And there are also a lot of bands doing what you all are doing with your books, too.)  I dunno what kind of living these musicians make, but they do get heard.</p>
<p>Seems to me that publishing has been handcuffed (or has handcuffed itself?) by its own perception of its audience.  I mean, do they ever think that a book that doesn&#8217;t quite fit the erotic romance mold or the inspirational romance mold, but has riveting drama and interesting characters might just appeal to parts of BOTH those audiences instead of neither?</p>
<p>This looks to me like an industry that&#8217;s too frightened of dying to survive.</p>
<p>I dunno, though; maybe I&#8217;m overestimating the independent part of the music biz and underestimating the indie part of book publishing.</p>
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		<title>By: RJ Keller</title>
		<link>http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/the-problem-of-genre-grit-romance/comment-page-1#comment-1783</link>
		<dc:creator>RJ Keller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Feb 2009 21:12:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/?p=975#comment-1783</guid>
		<description>Sure, you can pinch it, Lauri.

Thanks MoJo! Must be Mutual Admiration Society Day or something, because I think your book is awesome, too.

I found Lauri&#039;s book at Web Fiction Guide. They list and review free online books. There&#039;s some cool stuff listed there, with lots of out-of-the-ordinary fare (my book included [/shameless plug])

http://webfictionguide.com/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sure, you can pinch it, Lauri.</p>
<p>Thanks MoJo! Must be Mutual Admiration Society Day or something, because I think your book is awesome, too.</p>
<p>I found Lauri&#8217;s book at Web Fiction Guide. They list and review free online books. There&#8217;s some cool stuff listed there, with lots of out-of-the-ordinary fare (my book included [/shameless plug])</p>
<p><a href="http://webfictionguide.com/" rel="nofollow">http://webfictionguide.com/</a></p>
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		<title>By: MoJo</title>
		<link>http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/the-problem-of-genre-grit-romance/comment-page-1#comment-1781</link>
		<dc:creator>MoJo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Feb 2009 16:30:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/?p=975#comment-1781</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;it’s the oddest thing, I LOVE books that bend genres, that take the old, tired tropes and present them in a new and never-before-seen light&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I do, too, and either I&#039;m not looking in the right places for them or they&#039;re not high-profile enough or they&#039;re not being published.  Fortunately, I&#039;ve been able to find some of those in the indie-pub world lately.  Kel&#039;s book was awesome.

Lauri, you&#039;ll have to ask Kel.  She&#039;s the one who thunk it up, but lady, you better believe I&#039;m going to read your book!  &lt;i&gt;Servicing the Pole&lt;/i&gt;.  That&#039;s AWESOME.

Cliff and Lauri, please hang out more!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>it’s the oddest thing, I LOVE books that bend genres, that take the old, tired tropes and present them in a new and never-before-seen light</p></blockquote>
<p>I do, too, and either I&#8217;m not looking in the right places for them or they&#8217;re not high-profile enough or they&#8217;re not being published.  Fortunately, I&#8217;ve been able to find some of those in the indie-pub world lately.  Kel&#8217;s book was awesome.</p>
<p>Lauri, you&#8217;ll have to ask Kel.  She&#8217;s the one who thunk it up, but lady, you better believe I&#8217;m going to read your book!  <i>Servicing the Pole</i>.  That&#8217;s AWESOME.</p>
<p>Cliff and Lauri, please hang out more!</p>
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		<title>By: Lauri Shaw</title>
		<link>http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/the-problem-of-genre-grit-romance/comment-page-1#comment-1779</link>
		<dc:creator>Lauri Shaw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Feb 2009 13:48:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/?p=975#comment-1779</guid>
		<description>Grit lit - what a great label. Hope you don&#039;t mind if I pinch - uh, borrow - it from you. :-)

If you think your cover&#039;s risque, you should check out a memoir by this male stripper I know. I have a link to him on my page...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Grit lit &#8211; what a great label. Hope you don&#8217;t mind if I pinch &#8211; uh, borrow &#8211; it from you. <img src='http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>If you think your cover&#8217;s risque, you should check out a memoir by this male stripper I know. I have a link to him on my page&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Cliff Burns</title>
		<link>http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/the-problem-of-genre-grit-romance/comment-page-1#comment-1778</link>
		<dc:creator>Cliff Burns</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Feb 2009 05:40:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/?p=975#comment-1778</guid>
		<description>And, see, it&#039;s the oddest thing, I LOVE books that bend genres, that take the old, tired tropes and present them in a new and never-before-seen light. But the trend these days is &quot;niche&quot; publishing, puking out the same old same old with a new cover and interchangeable blurbs. Cookie cutter fiction. I wish you all the best with THE PROVISO and commend your courage for defying categorization and attempting to bring something new to the table.

More power to you...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And, see, it&#8217;s the oddest thing, I LOVE books that bend genres, that take the old, tired tropes and present them in a new and never-before-seen light. But the trend these days is &#8220;niche&#8221; publishing, puking out the same old same old with a new cover and interchangeable blurbs. Cookie cutter fiction. I wish you all the best with THE PROVISO and commend your courage for defying categorization and attempting to bring something new to the table.</p>
<p>More power to you&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: MoJo</title>
		<link>http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/the-problem-of-genre-grit-romance/comment-page-1#comment-1775</link>
		<dc:creator>MoJo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Feb 2009 20:21:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/?p=975#comment-1775</guid>
		<description>I can see yours being dirty realism.  Mine?  No.  Not minimalist enough and while yours is dramatic, mine is melodramatic, so I could go with &quot;grit lit&quot; as it seem to be in the process of being redefined.

And I never did get into Southern Angst nee Gothic.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can see yours being dirty realism.  Mine?  No.  Not minimalist enough and while yours is dramatic, mine is melodramatic, so I could go with &#8220;grit lit&#8221; as it seem to be in the process of being redefined.</p>
<p>And I never did get into Southern Angst nee Gothic.</p>
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		<title>By: RJ Keller</title>
		<link>http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/the-problem-of-genre-grit-romance/comment-page-1#comment-1774</link>
		<dc:creator>RJ Keller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Feb 2009 19:51:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://moriahjovan.com/mojo/?p=975#comment-1774</guid>
		<description>I did a bit more research this afternoon and discovered that &#039;grit lit&#039; is apparently a Southern writer term. Being a Damn Yankee, I didn&#039;t make the grit/grits connection. 

But in all seriousness, I do think it&#039;s being redefined, or at least that it&#039;s ready for a new definition. The more I think about it, the more I like &lt;i&gt;dirty realism.&lt;/i&gt; The biggest criticism about my book (so far!) is that the thing is &#039;too realistic.&#039; I took it as a compliment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I did a bit more research this afternoon and discovered that &#8216;grit lit&#8217; is apparently a Southern writer term. Being a Damn Yankee, I didn&#8217;t make the grit/grits connection. </p>
<p>But in all seriousness, I do think it&#8217;s being redefined, or at least that it&#8217;s ready for a new definition. The more I think about it, the more I like <i>dirty realism.</i> The biggest criticism about my book (so far!) is that the thing is &#8216;too realistic.&#8217; I took it as a compliment.</p>
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